MD & DO Chance With Academic violation on app. (weird situation)

[peter55]

Hello everyone, I honestly am just looking for some guidance or advice regarding my current situation.
So around 2 years ago (beginning of soph year) I was taking a test and before I handed it in I took out my phone sent a text, I still dont know what made me decide this was a good idea I really am still baffled by the level of stupidity I showed that day, and subsequently I was hit with an academic violation, I was on track for an A in the class and the board luckily showed mercy for my situation and reduced the level of the violation to that of as if it were like I cheated on a HW or lab, so I recieved a 0 for the test as opposed to the course, I finished with a C+. I then retook the class and got an A. I was reading other posts about this and saw that its pretty much the kiss of death on a premed application. I was just wondering is this the same for me as well and its now a pretty much a very very low chance anyone takes me now that I have this . Other than that I have a very strong gpa 3.9 almost and pretty good ECs, Volunteering, and leadership roles. I know what I did was wrong and I learned a lot from how the consequences of poor decision making can result in long-term effects. So I open this up to you guys, what to do you think, change my sights to else where considering how competitive med school is and this mark on app or still try and pursue
Thanks guys

And yes I do regret this decision every day, but I have to move on and learn from it.

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[SlythenClaw]

Hello everyone, I honestly am just looking for some guidance or advice regarding my current situation.
So around 2 years ago (beginning of soph year) I was taking a test and before I handed it in I took out my phone sent a text, I still dont know what made me decide this was a good idea I really am still baffled by the level of stupidity I showed that day, and subsequently I was hit with an academic violation, I was on track for an A in the class and the board luckily showed mercy for my situation and reduced the level of the violation to that of as if it were like I cheated on a HW or lab, so I recieved a 0 for the test as opposed to the course, I finished with a C+. I then retook the class and got an A. I was reading other posts about this and saw that its pretty much the kiss of death on a premed application. I was just wondering is this the same for me as well and its now a pretty much a very very low chance anyone takes me now that I have this . Other than that I have a very strong gpa 3.9 almost and pretty good ECs, Volunteering, and leadership roles. I know what I did was wrong and I learned a lot from how the consequences of poor decision making can result in long-term effects. So I open this up to you guys, what to do you think, change my sights to else where considering how competitive med school is and this mark on app or still try and pursue
Thanks guys

And yes I do regret this decision every day, but I have to move on and learn from it.

Hi there!

I would definitely talk to a premed advisor about this. However, I can tell you that most secondary applications have an "is there anything we should know about you/your application/your academic history" essay. You can check sdn for the last cycle's essays for the schools you'd like to apply to. I would take some time to write a very well written essay explaining the situation and what you learned (basically a more eloquent and compelling version of this post) and bring it to your first or second appointment with your premed advisor. I would also take this essay to the English tutors/writing center or whatever other place at your university that helps you write and edit essays as this may be one of your more important ones.

Sorry this is haunting you, good luck!

 

[jarednogeek]

“I sent an unrelated text during an exam and this violated test taking policy, I received a 0 for the exam.” You’ll be fine, definitely a red flag but with a solid app and MCAT you should get in somewhere. If you do decent on the MCAT I could maybe see an MD and pretty likely a DO taking a chance on you. Moral and ethical integrity is pretty important as a doc so they take that very seriously.

 

[Goro]

“I sent an unrelated text during an exam and this violated test taking policy, I received a 0 for the exam.” You’ll be fine, definitely a red flag but with a solid app and MCAT you should get in somewhere. If you do decent on the MCAT I could maybe see an MD and pretty likely a DO taking a chance on you. Moral and ethical integrity is pretty important as a doc so they take that very seriously.

I want to put a stake of heart of these ill-informed notions that DO schools are more forgiving of IAs.

We're not.

If OP owns their transgression, then I can see MD and DO feasible for OP, as there are people who believe in redemption.

But word of warning, OP, do something this stupid in med school and you'd be dismissed.

 

[Walter Raleigh]

@Goro: wouldn't he want to be ~5 years out from the infraction, and do something very responsible and altruistic during his gap years such as Teach for America, Peace Corps, or military service to be considered to have redeemed himself?

 

[peter55]

Thank you all for your replies, I really do appreciate that you took your time out of your day to respond.
@Goro I actually read some of your posts on other AV posts and am very curious as to what you believe my situation is looking like. Usually from what I read AVs are like the end of a pre-med career, however, to you believe that in my situation without any gap years taken to do something extraordinarily altruistic such as walter referenced that it is still possible I land a seat somewhere? Of course I have my normal volunteering and etc (service trips, relays, walks, volunteer ems, normal pre-med stuff) but I have nothing like Military Service under my belt.
Thank you once again, it is great to hear though that it may still be feasible for me continue my aspirations to become a physician.

 

[Goro]

Thank you all for your replies, I really do appreciate that you took your time out of your day to respond.
@Goro I actually read some of your posts on other AV posts and am very curious as to what you believe my situation is looking like. Usually from what I read AVs are like the end of a pre-med career, however, to you believe that in my situation without any gap years taken to do something extraordinarily altruistic such as walter referenced that it is still possible I land a seat somewhere? Of course I have my normal volunteering and etc (service trips, relays, walks, volunteer ems, normal pre-med stuff) but I have nothing like Military Service under my belt.
Thank you once again, it is great to hear though that it may still be feasible for me continue my aspirations to become a physician.

I don't see any ill intentions from your mistake, and that's the difference here. It was a case of outright stupidity. Some Adcom members might say "why take a chance on this kid?" but others might say "we were all young and stupid once too".

Just have a Plan B ready.

 

[SlythenClaw]

Thank you all for your replies, I really do appreciate that you took your time out of your day to respond.
@Goro I actually read some of your posts on other AV posts and am very curious as to what you believe my situation is looking like. Usually from what I read AVs are like the end of a pre-med career, however, to you believe that in my situation without any gap years taken to do something extraordinarily altruistic such as walter referenced that it is still possible I land a seat somewhere? Of course I have my normal volunteering and etc (service trips, relays, walks, volunteer ems, normal pre-med stuff) but I have nothing like Military Service under my belt.
Thank you once again, it is great to hear though that it may still be feasible for me continue my aspirations to become a physician.

Maybe consider also applying to postbac programs? You can find them at universities as well as federal institutions like the NIH, FDA, CDC, etc. It's kinda altruistic, in that you're a "public servant."

I'm loving my postbac at NCI, give it a thought

 

[peter55]

Hey guys just wanted to give an update as to my application I am currently sitting at a 514 on practice mcats (hopefully I pull the same on the real deal). As to my violation, I spoke to my advisor about it and she said its not on my transcript as the severity of it was reduced (as mentioned in the above post) however, I believe I am still going to report it because it is on record with the provost. She said I may not need to but if it was not officially expunged I am going to report it and hopefully my application doesn't get instantly denied. do you guys think there is still potential with MD schools, or is it best if I focus mainly on DO. Thanks guys

 

[Goro]

Hey guys just wanted to give an update as to my application I am currently sitting at a 514 on practice mcats (hopefully I pull the same on the real deal). As to my violation, I spoke to my advisor about it and she said its not on my transcript as the severity of it was reduced (as mentioned in the above post) however, I believe I am still going to report it because it is on record with the provost. She said I may not need to but if it was not officially expunged I am going to report it and hopefully my application doesn't get instantly denied. do you guys think there is still potential with MD schools, or is it best if I focus mainly on DO. Thanks guys

Yes, you are still Ok for MD.

But do NOT think that DO schools are more lenient with infractions. That's a major pre-med delusion and my DO colleagues are just as sticklers for professionalism and my MD colleagues.

 

[Moko]

Professionalism and integrity are fairly binary: you either have them or you don't. If you lack these qualities, no US medical school (MD or DO) will take you.

Fortunately, your situation here seems like a temporary lapse in judgment and does not seem malicious in nature. Some schools may still ding you for that, but what's done is done. As long as you own up to your mistake as you have done here, and make clear that the text was not related to the class as @jarednogeek mentioned, you should be fine. Obviously, apply broadly in light of this "IA".

My other thoughts:
- You should keep the explanation succinct. More writing = higher likelihood the important parts of the explanation are missed.
- I would not recommend doing any further post-bac coursework. Your GPA is fine, and a post-bac does nothing to address the IA.
- Also, as I recently learned here, clarify with the school board whether this constitutes an institutional action. It certainly seems like it, but you never know. If the school does interpret this as being an institutional action, then regardless of whether it is expunged, it needs to still be reported. Per AMCAS: "Medical schools need to know if you were ever the recipient of any institutional action resulting from unacceptable academic performance or a conduct violation, even if such action ... does not appear on your official transcripts due to institutional policy"

Just my thoughts. Good luck.

 

[Engrailed]

Hello everyone, I honestly am just looking for some guidance or advice regarding my current situation.
So around 2 years ago (beginning of soph year) I was taking a test and before I handed it in I took out my phone sent a text, I still dont know what made me decide this was a good idea I really am still baffled by the level of stupidity I showed that day, and subsequently I was hit with an academic violation, I was on track for an A in the class and the board luckily showed mercy for my situation and reduced the level of the violation to that of as if it were like I cheated on a HW or lab, so I recieved a 0 for the test as opposed to the course, I finished with a C+. I then retook the class and got an A. I was reading other posts about this and saw that its pretty much the kiss of death on a premed application. I was just wondering is this the same for me as well and its now a pretty much a very very low chance anyone takes me now that I have this . Other than that I have a very strong gpa 3.9 almost and pretty good ECs, Volunteering, and leadership roles. I know what I did was wrong and I learned a lot from how the consequences of poor decision making can result in long-term effects. So I open this up to you guys, what to do you think, change my sights to else where considering how competitive med school is and this mark on app or still try and pursue
Thanks guys

And yes I do regret this decision every day, but I have to move on and learn from it.

Seems like quite the punishment for something you did in sophomore year... to end up with a C+ from an A must have been rough. Im not an adcom by any means whatsoever but I hope they are forgiving and can see that what you did is from years ago and that you've since learned from your mistakes. Hope your application cycle goes well

 

[peter55]

Seems like quite the punishment for something you did in sophomore year... to end up with a C+ from an A must have been rough. Im not an adcom by any means whatsoever but I hope they are forgiving and can see that what you did is from years ago and that you've since learned from your mistakes. Hope your application cycle goes well

Thank you, although it wasn't great going from an A to a C+, its much better than what is supposed to be the minimum sanction (failure of class and IA on transcript) towards even possible suspension at the maximum I was also able to retake the class for an A. I am also glad I was able to learn a lot from the event itself, it was a rough time but changed me for the better.

Professionalism and integrity are fairly binary: you either have them or you don't. If you lack these qualities, no US medical school (MD or DO) will take you.

Fortunately, your situation here seems like a temporary lapse in judgment and does not seem malicious in nature. Some schools may still ding you for that, but what's done is done. As long as you own up to your mistake as you have done here, and make clear that the text was not related to the class as @jarednogeek mentioned, you should be fine. Obviously, apply broadly in light of this "IA".

My other thoughts:
- You should keep the explanation succinct. More writing = higher likelihood the important parts of the explanation are missed.
- I would not recommend doing any further post-bac coursework. Your GPA is fine, and a post-bac does nothing to address the IA.
- Also, as I recently learned here, clarify with the school board whether this constitutes an institutional action. It certainly seems like it, but you never know. If the school does interpret this as being an institutional action, then regardless of whether it is expunged, it needs to still be reported. Per AMCAS: "Medical schools need to know if you were ever the recipient of any institutional action resulting from unacceptable academic performance or a conduct violation, even if such action ... does not appear on your official transcripts due to institutional policy"

Just my thoughts. Good luck.

Thank you I will keep it brief and definitely include that my usage of the phone being unrelated to the exam, however, still a very poor lapse in judgment. I will meet with my provost to discuss the IA, but I am now confident in that it is an IA and I will be reporting. Thank you again, your advice is extremely helpful and it means a lot to me. I will also definitely be applying broadly, its hard enough to get into medical school let alone with an IA, however, it is reassuring to know that this IA will not completely end my application and that all this mcat studying isn't in futility (however I am surprisingly enjoying the amount I am relearning/learning from the mcat).